Well, hey! You discovered Moderate Divide. We take a moderate,
non-emotional look at two sides of a topic. Today's topic:
Patriotism. 'Merica! Let's roll!
Hello, I'm Patrick - proud patriot. A house divided cannot stand
As Americans, we need to stand together. So even if you disagree
with the president, you shouldn't threaten him, you shouldn't
mock him. You shouldn't disrespect people in uniform. You
shouldn't celebrate people who break the law. As Americans,
if we could all follow the rules, we could all get along, even
though we're all very different!
Hello! Safety man, George, here. I think it's important to
remember that law that were written 250 years ago, don't always
line up with today's world. They way we treated women, the fact
that we owned slaves. I think it's very important to remember that
our Constitution was written to be able to be amended. It's very
patriotic to keep up with social and technological trends.
So what makes someone a Patriot?
Look, if you love your country and its citizens, that's patriotic.
Some people are willing to take that to the extreme, and they're
willing to die for their country as soldiers. But for the rest of
us...vote in elections. Stand up for what matters. That's patriotic.
Well, Veterans for sure. And anyone who wears a uniform and tries
to protect our country. I would say any red-blooded American who
loves his country, who wants to uphold its values and make sure
we stay number one...hell that's a patriot to me.
It's not just America. You can be patriotic no matter what
country you're from. Gotta make sure you're not being xenophobic
when you're trying to be patriotic.
Let me clarify something: if I say "US first", it doesn't meant I
don't care about the other countries. It's like when you're on
an airplane and the oxygen mask drops down. You're supposed to put
your own mask on before you help someone else, right? Same thing.
This might be the most agreeable discussion yet!
We'll see. We both define patriot the same way, yes, but I don't
think we agree, necessarily, on when it applies. George has
mentioned "keeping up with the times" a few times, so I think
we might disagree there.
The big divide here, and probably in a lot of discussions, is not
necessarily the topic itself, but deciding exactly where it applies.
Patrick and I have talked previously about gun control and whether
or not we should allow more regulations.
We did, yes, and I think that's a great example, because I think
that asking us to give up our constitutional rights is very unpatriotic.
And I believe that looking out for the safety of our citizens
is extremely patriotic. Even - especially if it requires sacrifice.
So, we agree that we *should* be patriotic, but just don't
quite agree on what that means.
And we can disagree, but let's look at the defintion. A patriot is
defined as "someone who vigorously supports their country"
-Right we established that part.
-"and is prepared to defend it from its enemies and detractors."
See, this is a call to action. This is when, if we have a
disagreement, it can escalate.
Right, so the question is: Who's the enemy? Who are these detractors?
That's a good point because, anytime two people start arguing, it's
too easy to immediately decide "you're my enemy", and that's not healthy.
The problem is that when emotions flare up, logic goes out the
window. I mean people might call me racist and sexist about every
little thing, while they're trying to erode the foundation of our country
But disagreeing isn't a problem. We should encourage people to
think and to express their ideas, because this is the way you can
grow. And I think again, being willing to adapt and change and
grow is extremely patriotic.
Right, but as we figure out how we grow, there are certainly lines
that can't be crossed. There are certain principles that we were
founded on that we need to maintain.
Well, which lines do we care about? Who determines that? Is it
the president? The congress? Congress is supposed to be representing
their little portions of the country, so if their section of the
country wants change, they should be pushing for change.
Well, first and foremost, the constitution needs to be the
foundation for every political discussion. Beyond that, though,
if you're wanting everything to change, if you hate that much
about the country, that doesn't sound very patriotic to me.
No, don't hate your country, and yes, we should protect the
constitution. But the constitution was created to be amended.
The fact that we can change it, is not unpatriotic.
To an extent, yes, but we shouldn't be taking every radical,
extreme idea from social media and adding it to the constitution!
Of course there need to be limits, but think about it: at the time,
abolishing slavery, or giving women the right to vote, these
things were considered radical, and yet now they're amendments
that, at least most people, think we should keep.
This is true, and this is why these decisions are very important.
That's why we need to make sure we're doing what's best for our
country and for our future. We need to make sure it's not just
someone's upset that they're not getting their way. Once we've
decided something, that's the way it is - accept it.
That's how it is. Except when we made the 18th amendment. Which
was prohibition: prohibiting the sale of alcohol. That stayed in
effect for over a decade until we made the new amendment that said:
Never mind, we're getting rid of that one. So there is precedent
for removing amendments.
Touche. I guess it's a lot easier to look back in hindsight
and see what the right decision was. In the moment, though, we
still need to make sure we're making the best decision we can.
I feel like, unfortunately, a lot of people are swayed more by
emotion than logic. They let their partisanship guide them more
than their facts do.
Sure, I think there's so much outrage toward the president, that
people won't even listen to what he's saying, they will just
automatically reject it.
True, and I think it goes the other way too. His followers then
just accept whatever he says with no question.
Speaking of the president, here's a question from our social media feed:
Yes. Like I said earlier: a house divided cannot stand. We voted
for him, he's our president. That doesn't meant I agree with
everything - most of what he tweets is ridiculous. But he is still
our president. So I respect the position, I respect him in that position.
I think respect is very important, but like we pointed out earlier,
part of your patriotic duty is to call out detractors when you
see them. I think this goes all the way to the top of the chain.
So what does that mean? Every four to eight years there's a new
traitor in the white house?
No, not every time you disagree with someone - just because you
disagree with someone, doesn't mean the other person's a traitor.
But you dismissed his "ridiculous tweets" earlier, the problem is
if that makes us look like a laughing stock to the rest of the
world, then he *is* a detractor to our country.
Right. OR he's putting a strong foot down and negotiating us back
to success after previous presidents have weakened us.
Here's where it becomes dangerous. Our president questioned the
patriotism of football players who are kneeling. He wielded
patriotism in order to silence their protest.
But they were disrespecting the flag, which is disrespecting the
country. If they hate the country that much and they're that
unpatriotic, why would I watch their show?
But that's exactly my point, he's weaponized your feelings so you
feel like they are attacking you personally. He's created this
thing where we're no longer discussing the protest, but now we're
discussing whether or not this is offensive to me.
People are more likely to know about this controversy, than they are about the actual protest.
Maybe you're okay with the anthem protest, but I'm not.
Look, they're not protesting the anthem itself, they're pro-
This is not the topic, and we're definitely not going to agree on this!
Not likely!
The issue is manipulating people to agree with you by saying: The
thing I think, that's the patriotic choice!" It gets people to you
arbitrarily. It's like when he says the media - if he doesn't like
something, he calls it the enemy of the people. That way you feel
it's patriotic to also hate the media.
Fake news media.
Exactly, he's trying to take your patriotism and use that as a
reason for you to ignore stories he doesn't like.
Well, I'm not gonna apologize for being loyal to my country.
No, and you shouldn't. But free speech is patriotic. The first
amendment gives us the right to free speech - which is the right
to protest, and gives the right to have a press. These are not
things we should be attacking.
The president also has free speech, right? So he gave his opinion
and now you're attacking him for it.
I'm not attacking his free speech. I'm just pointing out that he's
manipulating people. He is using patriotism to serve his own ego.
Well, speaking of egos, obviously, America, we're number one!
Right? Patrick mentioned this plus his "America First"
movement. So let's talk more about that.
Sure, but I don't think it's "having an ego" to be proud to live
in the best country in the world. I mean, it's patriotic
to have pride in your country!
Look, it's great to love your country, but this idea that we're
number one, that we're superior to everyone else, is just false.
We're number 37th when it comes to healthcare, we're 17th in
education, and 27th when it comes to environmental concerns.
When it comes to taking care of our people and our planet,
we're far from number one.
Yeah, but your thing sounds a lot less patriotic.
See, right there, using patriotism to silence me.
I look at patriotism like this: you're at your kid's sports game
and you're watching them play, right? You yell out "You're the
best!" He's not the best, not at all. But you love your child,
you want to encourage your child, so you say that. You don't wanna
yell out "Try to be better!" That's not cool.
Well certainly don't insult them. Yeah, you want to encourage your
child, but you also need to point out their flaws so they can
improve and work on it and get better. You're not gonna improve
by thinking "I'm already the best".
And now for one last social media comment:
Look, if your leadership is failing you, stand up. Make changes.
If you don't feel you're being represented, vote for new people,
or run yourself if you're really passionate about it. We need
people who are willing to stand up and make changes. Not people
who are gonna run away.
Well, keep in mind, these leaders are voted in. So if you didn't
get the person you want, you're in the minority. You're kind of
alone in your opinion.
That assumes everyone is actually voting. When half the population
doesn't even vote, then we really don't know what the majority wants.
Well, sure we do. They decided their voice doesn't matter. So when
they don't get their way, we should continue to treat them like
their voice doesn't matter. It's very patriotic to vote. It's not
patriotic to not vote and then complain about it.
Well now that we've beaten each other, red, white and blue,
let's have our final thoughts.
It's great to have pride in your country, just make sure that
doesn't turn into xenophobia or nationalism. Patriotism doesn't
mean you do everything that everyone in your country says. But you
do have to stand up for it, and call out corruption when you see
it. That's patriotism.
And some times the people you have to stand against are the ones
within your own country. Some people's vision for our country is
not patriotic. It's not what we really stand for.
Well, as we say around here, you don't have to agree, you just
have to see their point. So Patrick, what is George's point?
As we said through the whole thing, we don't really disagree on
what patriotism is, just when it applies. George is mostly
concerned about the melting pot, the citizens. He wants to make 205 00:10:09,500 --> 00:10:14,000 sure they're taken care of. He's also concerned that some other
agendas can be disguised as patriotism.
And George? What about Patrick?
Patrick believes in America first, especially when it comes to the
constitution. He believes that we need to take care of ourselves
above all others. He doesn't see that as discrimination, but as
being a patriotic American.
Well, I hope you enjoyed another Moderate Divide. If you did,
let me know what you liked in the comments. And if you didn't,
let me know what you liked in the comments.
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