SOLEDAD: TOPEKA, KANSAS IS A
SMALL MIDWESTERN CITY,
POPULATION ROUGHLY 127,000,
WHICH ABOUT 14,000 ATTEND THE
CITY'S PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
IN SIZE, IT IS SIMILAR TO
MANCHESTER, NEW HAMPSHIRE AND
MEDFORD, OREGON.
ITS HISTORY, HOWEVER, SETS IT
APART.
IN 1954, TOPEKA WAS AT THE
CENTER OF THE DEBATE OVER SCHOOL
SEGREGATION DURING THE LANDMARK
SUPREME COURT CASE "BROWN VERSUS
THE BOARD OF EDUCATION."
THE RULING OVERTURNED THE
DOCTRINE OF SEPARATE BUT EQUAL,
DECLARING UNCONSTITUTIONAL ANY
LAW ALLOWING RACIAL SEGREGATION
IN EDUCATION.
60 YEARS AGO, THE ISSUE WAS
INTEGRATIO
SO WHAT DOMINATES THE DISCUSSION
TODAY?
I TRAVELED TO HIGHLAND PARK HIGH
SCHOOL IN TOPEKA, TO MODERATE A
CONVERSATION ABOUT EQUALITY, IN
A PLACE WHERE THEY DON'T SHY
AWAY FROM CHALLENGES.
D'ANDRE: ALL MY LIFE, I'VE BEEN
HOMELESS.
ME AND MY FAMILY CAME FROM A
SINGLE-MOTHER HOUSEHOLD,
SINGLE-PARENT HOUSEHOLD.
AND, YOU KNOW, WE NEVER HAD
REALLY CONSISTENCY OR STRUCTURE.
WE MOVED ALMOST EVERY YEAR O
HALF A YEAR.
SOLEDAD: WHAT MADE THE BIGGEST
DIFFERENCE FOR YOU?
D'ANDRE: I ACTUALLY HAD TEACHERS
AND PRINCIPALS WHO TOOK A ST
OUTSIDE OF JUST THE WORKPLACE,
AND THEY SAID, D'ANDRE, WHAT CAN
WE DO FOR YOU?
HOW CAN WE HELP YOU?
WHAT'S ANOTHER WAY WE CAN HELP
YOU GO TO SCHOOL?
ARE YOU HUNGRY TODAY?
DO YOU NEED ANY MONEY?
SOLEDAD: THE AUDITORIUM WAS
FILLED WITH PARENTS, TEACHERS,
AND COMMUNITY MEMBERS, THERE TO
SCREEN A NEW SERIES CALLED
"UNDERCOVER HIGH."
IT SENT ADULTS BACK TO HIGH
SCHOOL UNDERCOVER, TO SEE WHAT
NEW CHALLENGES AND STRUGGLES
STUDENTS FACE.
IN ADDITION TO EQUALITY, ONE OF
THE BIGGEST SURPRISES, ACCORDING
TO THE ADULTS, WAS THE PROLIFIC
USE OF SOCIAL MEDIA AT SCHOOL,
AND ALMOST CONSTANT
CYBERBULLYING.
SOCIAL MEDIA ISN'T JUST A
PROBLEM FOR HIGH SCHOOL
STUDENTS.
FACEBOOK ADMITTED THIS WEEK THAT
IT CAN NO LONGER GUARANTEE
THAT SOCIAL MEDIA WAS GOOD FOR
DEMOCRAC
IT WAS JUST LAST YEAR THAT CEO
MARK ZUCKERBERG SAID IT WAS
"CRAZY" TO SUGGEST FACEBOOK ADS
INFLUENCED THE 2016 ELECTION
BUT ULTIMATELY, FACEBOOK FOUND
THAT RUSSIAN AGENTS CREATED
80,000 POSTS THAT REACHED ABOUT
126 MILLION PEOPLE.
NOW, THE LARGEST SOCIAL NETWORK
IS TAKING A HARD LOOK AT THE
IMPACT IT HAS ON THE DEMOCRATIC
PROCES
HARVARD PROFESSOR CASS SUNSTEIN
IS THE AUTHOR OF "HASHTAG
REPUBLIC -- DIVIDED DEMOCRACY IN
THE AGE OF SOCIAL MEDIA,
FOCUSING ON "GROUP POLARIZATION"
-- SOMETHING HE SAYS IS
REPLICATED ON SOCIAL MEDIA EVERY
DAY.
THANKS FOR BEING HER
CASS: PLEASURE TO BE HERE.
SOLEDAD: NICE TO HAVE YOU.
SO, LET'S BEGIN WITH A LITTLE
BIT OF WHAT THIS POLARIZATION
IS.
I MEAN, IS IT NATURALLY PEOPLE
ARE DIVIDED, OR SOCIAL MEDIA
ACTUALLY DOING THE DIVIDING?
CASS: THE IDEA IS, IF YOU HAVE A
GROUP OF PEOPLE WHO KIND OF
AGREE WITH EACH OTHER ON CLIMATE
CHANGE OR GUN CONTROL OR THE
MINIMUM WAGE OR #METOO, IF THEY
TALK TO EACH OTHER, THEY'LL END
UP THINKING A MORE EXTREME
VERSION OF WHAT THEY THOUGHT
BEFORE THEY STARTED TO TALK.
AND SO GROUPS CAN GO WOOSH TO
THE RIGHT, AND WOOSH TO THE
LEFT, BECAUSE OF THE DYNAMICS OF
SOCIAL INTERACTION.
AND IT'S PRETTY NATURAL IF
YOU'RE TALKING TO PEOPLE WHO
AGREE WITH YOU, AND HERE ARE
LOTS OF ARGUMENTS SUPPORTING
THAT VIEW AND NOT MANY OF THE
OTHER WAY, AND THAT'LL PUSH YOU
TO THE LEFT OR THE RIGHT.
NOW WHAT WE'VE LEARNED SINCE THE
INCEPTION OF SOCIAL MEDIA IS
THAT THAT KIND OF OLD FINDING,
AND IT IS AS OLD AS HUMAN
HISTORY AND ACTION, IS BEING
REPLICATED ON FACEBOOK AND ON
TWITTER ALL THE TIME.
SOLEDAD: BUT FASTER?
IS THAT PART OF THE ISSUE?
CASS: REALLY FAST, AND MORE
OFTEN -- BOTH SPEEDIER AND MORE
OFTEN.
AND THE REAL REASON IS ON SOCIAL
MEDIA IT'S -- YOU KNOW, YOU CAN
DO IT IN AN INSTANT, TALK AND
LISTEN TO PEOPLE WHO ARE EXACTLY
LIKE YOU, WHEREAS BEFORE SOCIAL
MEDIA OR OUTSIDE OF SOCIAL
MEDIA, THAT MIGHT BE A LITTLE
MORE CHALLENGING, BECAUSE IF YOU
READ THE NEWSPAPER OR TURN ON
THE TELEVISION, THERE ARE LOTS
OF DIFFERENT VOICES, IF THINGS
ARE WORKING WELL AT LEAST.
AND SO THE USE OF SOCIAL MEDIA
AS KIND OF AN ENGINE FOR GROUP
POLARIZATION IS DISTURBING,
PROBABLY ALARMING FROM THE
DEMOCRATIC POINT OF VIEW.
SOLEDAD: YOU'VE SPENT A LOT OF
TIME IN SILICON VALLEY.
DO YOU THINK THAT THEY'RE
BEGINNING TO UNDERSTAND THAT
THERE'S A RESPONSIBILITY IN THIS
THING THEY'VE CREATED, THAT THEY
HAVE TO GO BACK AND TWEAK?
I'M NOT EVEN SURE WHO THE THEY
IS.
BUT THE SYSTEM
CASS: I THINK SILICON VALLEY IS
A BIG PLACE, AND THERE ARE
PEOPLE WHO THINK, "OUR JOB IS TO
PROVIDE PEOPLE WHAT THEY WANT,
LIKE WE'RE PROVIDING SHOES OR
SNEAKERS, NOTHING'S BROKEN."
BUT A LOT OF THE PEOPLE AT
FACEBOOK IN PARTICULAR ARE AWARE
THAT THEY CAN DO BETTER, AND YOU
CAN SEE FROM THEIR CHANGING THE
NEWS FEED AND THEIR SWITCH IN
THEIR JUDGMENT OF WHAT THE
UNDERLYING VALUES THEY'RE TRYING
TO PROMOTE ARE.
YOU CAN SEE THAT THEY'RE VERY
CONCERNED BOTH ABOUT BEING
DELUGED WITH FAKE NEWS AND ABOUT
PEOPLE BEING IN LITTLE ECHO
CHAMBERS OF THEIR OWN DESIGN.
I THINK THEY'RE AWARE OF THE
PROBLEM.
SOLEDAD: SO WHAT'S THE FIX OF
THAT?
CASS: WELL HERE'S A DIRECTION OF
A FIX.
IT'S VERY GOOD TO HAVE, LET'S
SAY, A NEWS FEED ALGORITHM THAT
DOESN'T JUST FEED, SO TO SPEAK,
PEOPLE LOUDER AND MORE NUMEROUS
VERSIONS OF WHAT THEY ALREADY
THINK, BUT GIVES THEM UNPLANNED
SERENDIPITOUS EXPOSURE TO TOPICS
AND IDEA
SO YOU MIGHT SEE SOMETHING
THAT'S A LITTLE JARRING ON YOUR
NEWS FEED.
THAT'S OKAY.
THAT'S PART OF WHAT IT MEANS TO
BE A CITIZEN RATHER THAN A
CONSUMER IN, YOU KNOW, WHAT
AT GOOD MOMENTS THE GREATEST
DEMOCRACY IN THE HISTORY OF THE
WORLD.
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