Waching daily Sep 1 2017

I see it now this day has made it all too clear you're better than me Kakarot

you are the best. At the ending of Dragon Ball Z there was a moment when Goku was

fighting against Kid Buu where Fujita had a major revelation and this

revelation was the fact that Vegeta openly admitted that Goku was a better

fighter than he was so the question is is Vegeta actually out of character so

let's get started so to start off geekdom what is your initial opinion on

this discussion as a whole because you expressed some of your opinions about

this recently and that alternate ending to Dragon Ball Z well you're referring

to the fact that Vegeta at the end of the series during Goku's fight with Kid

Buu comes to term for the fact that Goku is number one he states that Goku is the

number one fighter and that Vegeta has struggled for so long to surpass him and

to defeat him and actually at some point kill Goku take his life and at the end

of the series he realized that Goku was the top dog but in the first episode of

Super we have scenes where Vegeta and in the second episode where Vegeta is

really contemplating surpassing Goku and getting a little salty at the fact that

he was the one that beat Kid Buu even though I feel like it was more of a

combined effort and at the end of the cons in bond manga Toriyama rewrote it

so that Vegeta says I'm gonna continue to try to surpass you I can understand

people not liking that because they feel like it's somewhat undercuts Vegeta's

character arc at the end of the park but I would disagree I don't hate that at

all because number one he can change his mind and the battle of gods arc takes

place roughly four years after the end of the blue arc and you could easily

just think and say that Vegeta has been dwelling on this for a long time and he

wants to be not just the strongest fighter but also the strongest Saiyan

ever and Goku is the only other pureblood saying that still lives you

know in universe 7 that is obviously universe six is a different story by the

way guys just to add a little quick point this is not counting Tarble if you

want to count heaven no we're not counting it just in super like what

we've seen the suit for the main guys so I think he sees Goku as a person he can

with to get stronger that's the way I've always seen it wow I mean I think you

make a lot of amazing points there geekdom and if I were to talk about

Vegeta saying that in the first place I've always thought ever since I was a

kid that it was Super Saiyan 3 that really opened up Vegeta's eyes to goku

because if you go back to the whole majin buu jitta thing you know he and

goku were fighting toe-to-toe and goku was super saiyan too and you know bajina

thought that with bobby's power that he had closed the gap between him and goku

but despite that Vegeta now sees in the afterlife that after all of this time

that has passed Goku can still completely surpassed Vegeta with Super

Saiyan 3 so it's like all this time he thought he had closed the gap that he

had done everything in his power to approach his rival he's still on a

completely lower level than him and I think that's one of the reasons why

during the Kid Buu fight he had that revelation because he's looking at

himself he's like I can't even fight against this creature whereas this guy

can well but keep them there's something that I want us to go all the way back to

Dragon Ball Z for here that a lot of people haven't discussed except for

black and fist who was that there was an ax that sounds like a youtuber from many

moons ago roam throughout the Dragon Ball series and from goq Vegeta's

childhood all the way to Vegeta's adulthood he was weaker than a lot of

freezes top tier henchmen like Kui Zarb on the Doria the ginyu force and such

besides gould of course hey and in the interesting thing is this

that it seemed like Vegeta was more complacent with whatever power he had

prior to all of the battles on Namek and and that's really interesting thing

because what it is is that he comes from a culture that is entirely based on

numbers and your battle power when you're born and I think that what it is

is that when he realized that a lower level saying one that was said to be a

cast-off one that was said to be a jabroni when he realized that Goku was

able to surpass him tremendously with or without the kaio-ken and was able to at

least compete with him on earth he realized ok these numbers are all

bullshit like the whole power levels are bullshit mean that's

pretty much what it is he knew that just because you raped my power level at

Birth does not mean that I cannot train and get stronger it's nature versus

nurture and its best form so that's the story that is the story is that he

pretty much realized okay if if this low-level saying on earth can surpass me

what am i capable of you know he's thinking you know what I'm gonna surpass

all of them and he did eventually and and it's all because of Goku I think

that's really the main revelation of that character that you realized that

those battle powers when you're born mean nothing when you can train and get

stronger right and I think if there's one more thing we need to add to this

video here geekdom it would have to be GT so I think Dragon Ball GT is a very

interesting conversation to compare to super because looking at GT geekdom it

seems like Vegeta was way more accepting of Goku being number one as opposed to

super so super is keeping the rivalry more alive but in GT it seems like

Vegeta isn't really motivated to really surpass Goku until he decides to become

a Super Saiyan for late into the Shadow Dragon arc so it does seem like GT was

trying to make Vegeta more in character to the ending of Z than super is which

is kind of weird that's a great point though and I totally agree they remember

they were writing that back then and Toriyama had not yet written the content

bond ending he had not yet given the story nose to the writers of Super Bowl

toil taro and Tollway that Vegeta was going to keep going with a little quest

to surpass Goku so they just took what they saw at the end of the Z arc or the

Z saga Dragon Ball Z and we're like ok let's just do it because if you think

about it when he wanted to become a Super Saiyan 4 it was more so out of

necessity they knew that they had to get stronger to fight against these evil

dragons and he knew that he could help and he knew that if Goku could achieve

this power so can i and he had Balma help him which some people think was a

very kind of you know kind of a bitch move I don't think it was but I feel

like that's what happened that it was more so because he actually wanted to

save the earth and not be wiped out by the evil dragons versus him just wanting

to surpass Goku that's the way I always saw it and it does it does fit better

with the end of Z I mean it totally does you can't

argue that right and I think the interesting thing about the whole GT arc

in general is that Vegeta's body was being used as an evil ploy for baby

against Goku so in a way goku did kind of fight vegeta all over again albeit

Vegeta was possessed so I think GT was kind of bringing up that whole Goku

versus Vegeta theme where it's like okay can Goku defeat Vegeta

with another person amplifying his power even more and with some assistance Goku

is able to even do that so I think ultimately Vegeta has always been like a

test for Goku's abilities and I think ultimately my consensus on all of this

conversation is that I don't think Vegeta is out of character and super I

think he always wants to Train however I do think if you go with Dragon Ball GT

it definitely seems like they were following more of the ending of Z as in

the ending of Z Vegeta even mentions that there was no point of participating

in a tournament because he thought Goku was gonna win it all by himself so I all

think this is an interesting conversation but what are your final

thoughts on this geekdom no I love this conversation like I said if people don't

like it I I mean that's fine I think it's fine that Vegeta it's a different

Vegeta dude you can't sit here and tell me but Jesus got no development when

Vegeta is much more of a family man in super the way he reacted when his

daughter was born you know so many different things that lead me to believe

that Vegeta has evolved as a person but he still has pride he still has ego and

he still has a willingness to get stronger because much like GT Vegeta he

also I think believes that they might need his help you know not just in the

tournament of power going on now but whatever threat may come to them plus in

the Goku black arc you can tell that he was enjoying beating up Goku black but

when that one episode where he's whooping his ass and he's like you're

just a counterfeit saying that's more of his pride like you don't understand like

you're disrespecting my race and you're just spreading Kakarot which even though

that's not his they're not his alone to kill hacker right anymore he has a lot

of respect for Kaka rod and I think that's where things have changed it he

has respect for Goku people have to realize that man that's the way I've

always seen as the way I think Toriyama intended it to be seen

in my opinion absolutely brought if I were to add one more point here about GT

I think the proof of Vegeta's rivalry burning with Goku is the fact that when

Super 17 showed up and everybody was getting rekt there was that scene where

Vegeta was angry that people were short cutting him and just wanting to fight

against Goku and kind of making it look like he was secondary to Goku which he

was but you know the fact that his pride is still high enough that even if he's

weaker than Goku he's always gonna want to continue pushing so ultimately I

think Vegeta is not out of character I'm pretty sure geekdom agrees and check out

my bro keep them in the description I'm gonna be posting a link to his channel

so you guys can check him out and in addition to this also check out geek

Tim's video on Dragon Balls alternate ending where you see him actually break

down the difference between what originally happened in the manga and the

cons and bond changed by Toriyama many years later so it was a great video and

I'm sure you guys will appreciate that so with everything else said please

remember to rate comment and subscribe and remember as I always say to have a

great day guys